HONG KONG (SE): “If I see the gospel message only in the socio-political reduction, yes, I am a communist, and so too is Jesus,” said Pope Francis on November 22, speaking to a group of journalists from the Jesuit magazine, America, at his residence at Santa Marta at the Vatican.
“I try to follow the gospel. I am much enlightened by the Beatitudes, but above all by the standard by which we will be judged: Matthew 25. “I was thirsty, and you gave me a drink. I was in prison, and you visited me. I was sick, and you cared for me.” Is Jesus a communist, then?” the pope mused hypothetically.
“Behind these Beatitudes and Matthew 25, there is a message that is Jesus’ own. And that is to be Christian. The communists stole some of our Christian values [laughter]. Some others, they made a disaster out of them,” the pope said.
Various topics were discussed with the pope, including women’s ordination, racial profiling, abortion, the conflict in Ukraine and Russia, and Vatican relations with China.
Gerard O’Connell, America’s Vatican correspondent, pointed out to the pope that he had been criticised over the agreement with China on the nomination of bishops.
It is not a matter of speaking or silence. That is not the reality. The reality is to dialogue or not to dialogue. And one dialogues up to the point that is possible
He asked the pope whether the Vatican and the Church are paying a high price for maintaining silence on human rights in China.
“It is not a matter of speaking or silence. That is not the reality. The reality is to dialogue or not to dialogue. And one dialogues up to the point that is possible,” Pope Francis responded.
He cited the story of Agostino Cardinal Casaroli, who was assigned by popes Paul VI and John XXIII to the countries of Central Europe to try to re-establish relations during the period of communism and the Cold War.
The cardinal “dialogued with governments and was eventually able to re-establish the Catholic hierarchy in those countries. For example—I think of one case—it was not always possible to appoint the best person as archbishop in the capital, but instead, the one that was possible according to the government.”
In his address, the pope reiterated his position that dialogue with the Chinese government is the best way of diplomacy.
“With China, I have opted for the way of dialogue. It is slow, it has its failures, and it has its successes, but I cannot find another way. And I want to underline this: The Chinese people are people of great wisdom and deserve my respect and my admiration. I take off my hat to them. I try to dialogue with people because we are not going to conquer people. No! There are Christians there. They have to be cared for so that they may be good Chinese and good Christians,” he said.
With China, I have opted for the way of dialogue. It is slow, it has its failures, and it has its successes, but I cannot find another way. And I want to underline this: The Chinese people are people of great wisdom and deserve my respect and my admiration. I take off my hat to them.
The interview took place before the Chinese authorities appointed Bishop John Peng Weizhao of Yujiang as auxiliary bishop of Jiangxi, a diocese not recognised by the Holy See, on November 24 [see page 3]. According to AsiaNews, Bishop Peng was secretly ordained bishop of Yujiang with a papal mandate in 2014, which led to his arrest. He was held in jail for six months and, after his release, was subjected to restrictions on his ministry.
Last September, Bishop Peng told the priests of the diocese that he had resigned as bishop of Yujiang and accepted the government’s plan to integrate five dioceses, including Yujiang, into one, the new Diocese of Jiangxi. In response to the Chinese government violating its agreement on the appointment of Catholic bishops, the Vatican issued a public statement of surprise and regret.
“This event, in fact, did not take place in accordance with the spirit of dialogue existing between the Vatican and Chinese sides and what was stipulated in the provisional agreement on the appointment of bishops,” the statement from the Vatican said.
